Nov. 22, 2024

The Shapeshifter at the Border and the Murder of Ramon Casiano

The Shapeshifter at the Border and the Murder of Ramon Casiano

Border Patrol agent Juan and his partner Alex keep coming across horrific scenes of dead migrants, then, dead agents. Something is hunting them. One night, they see it for themselves. 

Carmen shares this story and Cristina talks about the murder of...

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Border Patrol agent Juan and his partner Alex keep coming across horrific scenes of dead migrants, then, dead agents. Something is hunting them. One night, they see it for themselves.

Carmen shares this story and Cristina talks about the murder of Ramon Casiano. Almost nothing is known about him, but his murder went on to head Border Patrol and the NRA.

First they read a listener story and then end with spooky recommendations.

If you have a spooky story to share, email Espookytales@gmail.com or leave us a voicemail at the Espooky Hot Line (360)836-4486. You can also submit it on Discord!

Join the Espooky Tales Book Club for Busy People: https://substack.com/@espooky?utm_source=profile-page

Listen to Carmen and Cristina's other podcast Historias Unknown

The next book club read is the Witches of El Paso by Luis Jaramillo, if you want to purchase the book, check out our bookshop link https://bookshop.org/lists/espooky-book-club-list

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Thank you for listening!

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WEBVTT

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Hi, this is Christina and Carmen, and this is another

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episode of a Spooky Tells a podcaster all things spooky,

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true crime Latin America related. And today is what I

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guess like a border episode. Oh okay, I was like,

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what you're taking? Sorry, I say this my brain. I'm

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so let me just tell you. I'm so tired today.

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So oh okay, we're in the same camp. I took

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my meds. I doubled them because I'm on my period,

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but they still have worn out. They work less when

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I'm on my period without them, I mean. Yeah, yeah,

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so I'm extra slow today and Carmen's dying, so that's

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just the vibes that we're bringing dying. Yeah. So yeah,

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where I found a border story. Unfortunately it's from the

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side of Border Patrol. Uck. Yeah, I hope they're haunted.

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And then the true crime case actually also ties into

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Border Patrol and our estia is unknown episode on Operation Web. Yeah. Wow,

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it's we have a theme going, the theme going FBP

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f tbp P. Yes, F not what I said F

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t b P oh though I only said f c

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B I did that first and then I added it. Okay, yeah, okay, okay,

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So should we get to the listener story or is

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this something else you want? Yeah? No, no, Just if

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you have a story that you want to send to

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the podcast, you can email a spooky toes at gmail

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dot com. You can submit it on Discord Discord fifty

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members deep so whoa Whoa. You can also message me

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on any of the socials just as pooky tees. That's

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where this one is from today. You can also call

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these spooky hotline that numbers in the show notes. A

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lot of ways to get it to us. So, yeah,

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let's hear the listener story. Cool. So this is from

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mister Fusion on ig Hey, Carmin and Christina. I wanted

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to submit this somewhat spooky story for y'all's awesome podcast.

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I've never been sensitive to the paranormal, despite being super

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interested in the subject. Before this story that I'm about

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to share with you happened, the most paranormal thing that

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had ever happened to me was feeling a cold spot. Anyway,

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my wife and I for the past few years visit

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my brother in law and his family during our Christmas

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break down in South Texas. My brother in law and

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his wife had four boys at the time, of this

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possible paranormal event. My brother in law and his wife

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are church going Christian people. My wife and I have

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not gone to church in many years, so I'm grateful

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that my brother in law and his wife are good

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people and still let us stay at their house and

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feed us when we visit. That's good. Yeah, I mean

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he said good Christian people, So yeah. Yeah. After a

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couple of years living in their current house, two of

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their boys started experiencing something touching, slash grabbing their legs

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while they slept. It only happened in a specific room,

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so they refused to sleep in that room. Turns out

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that was a room they would let us sleep in

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when we stay at their house. Damn, damn, I mean yeah,

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no one else is using it. Right after hearing that story,

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I did not experience anything paranormal until this one night

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we were staying there. I was sound asleep. I wake

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up for whatever reason and see what looks like a

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shadow person standing right next to the bed. At first,

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I thought that one of my nephews got in the

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room because the shadow was small and looked like a kid.

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They couldn't have even gone in the room, though, because

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I always locked the door room you sleep, even when

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I'm at my own house, so all of this is

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going through my mind. In a matter of seconds, I

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all of a sudden remember the stories and rub my

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eyes to make sure I'm actually seeing what I think

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I'm seeing. All of a sudden, the shadow kid slowly

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fades away and disappears. I lay there for a few minutes, stunned,

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trying to process this. Then I fell back asleep because

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I'm just way too sleep I mean, yeah, relatable. I

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tell my wife about what happened, and she was totally stunned.

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After that, we never really spoke about it. I don't

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remember telling my brother in law about this experience because

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I wasn't one hundred percent sure I saw what I

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think I saw. I never experienced anything like that since,

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and as far as I know, my nephew's never had

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any other occurrences either. After thinking about it, this was,

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in fact a ghost I saw. I thought maybe it

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was the ghost of a kid that would have mess

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my nephews because they wanted to play with them or something.

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I don't know, but I swear I saw something that night.

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You probably did, I feel like you did. Yeah, And

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then if you mentioned it, or talked about it. It

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made it more real, so you didn't say anything, you know. Yeah, yeah,

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that's scary though. You know though, at least it was

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like a one time thing. Yeah. Even then if you

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stopped seeing stuff, so that's good. Maybe it just wanted

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to be seen one time. The kid was just saying goodbye. Yeah,

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it was like passing through for a little bit and

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then he's like, all right, I'm out. I just want

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time to go, mister fusion to see me before one

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last person? Yeah, one last person. That's it. Damn, that's

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uh care people honestly, out of like ghost experiences, that's

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probably like the one you want. Like if I have

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to have a ghost experience, which I don't want to,

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and this is not a welcome to haunt me a message,

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but if I had to have a ghost experience, like

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that would have not been so bad, you know. Yeah,

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just oh is that is that when I'm sleepy? Yeah yeah,

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then you don't ever see it again, so yeah, not

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too bad. It could be worse, could be a lot worse.

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It could be a lot worse. Yeah yeah, okay, So

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should I get into my story now? I don't know

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I saything like that. I don't know mus story. It

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kind of remind me of that guy on TikTok who's

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like that that friend who keeps using weird vocabulary. And

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I was like, oh my god, it's me. Like when

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I kept saying I reckon and You're like, fucking stop,

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that was you. It was like months long she kept

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saying I reckon this, and I'm like, did this fuck it? Bitch?

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Just want terrry potter or what the fuck? Like what

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is this going on? She thinks she's taking English or

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some shit like who says I reckon? Like I don't know,

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I did it. Not Mexicans unless they're from British or Britain, Yeah, England.

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Have you come across the Britain Mexicans on? Yeah, that's

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why I added that. Yeah, they're really funny, so funny,

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just like they're like talking in the British accent and

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then the Spanish sounds normal and then right, so it's trippy,

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like obviously it's a thing, you know. Yeah, yeah, so

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it's just strange. Anyway, Why couldn't I end up there?

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I don't know what's worse. I don't know it's worse.

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I don't know, because it seems like the weather they brexit. Yeah, right,

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but there's castles over there. I really wanted to see

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a castle. Oh yeah, but I heard their feet sucks.

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But if you're Mexican. But the quality of the meat

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also matters, so whatever. Okay, No, it's like the ingredients

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that are not available, right, That's what I was like

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getting at with the meat, yeah, or the seasoning. Anyway,

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let's get into the story. I would rather be in California, true, true, No,

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I would rather be in California too. Yeah, we had

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to fuck off to Washington. I know, I'm ruined. It's

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so cold and wet here right now, and I just

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imagine we would never survive in England. You know what,

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I wonder if I'm also having some No, it's sad.

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When I've been sad, it was some sad season maybe

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time so tired because it's so darkic actually seasonal ass depression.

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It's like around three pm. Was like yeah, because yeah,

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it was like four thirty and it was already dark

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and it's been raining all day. It's not raining here yet. Okay,

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onto the story. So this is about a border patrol.

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So insert barth noises. This is from GETT to loose

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YouTube channel and it's in Spanish, so the video is

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cas migrants and one had been a border patrol officer

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for thirty years, most of that time was spent on

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the border between Arizona and Sonora in Mexico. Over the years,

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he felt that he had seen it all, tragedies and

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injustices that made him question humanity. But what took place

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toward the end of October nineteen ninety three made him

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almost quit. That morning started like they all did. They

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went to get their assignment and the route they were

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supposed to patrol. His route was in the straight up desert.

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He had come across thirsty and hungry people, and of

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course those that died trying to cross, trying to reach

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the American dream, something that felt like a lie and

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an allusion to him. I guess he was a real one.

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Join the club brother at Mano. He had seen all

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sorts of things, people at their lowest, people stealing someone's

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last bit of food, killing over it. But he understood

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it was such an unfortunate thing to lose your life

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in a place like this. Kwan and Alex, his partner,

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were talking about this when they saw women walking toward

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them This was not uncommon. Sometimes it was the last

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resort for a migrant they were out of food, water,

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and options. He always thought it was better to turn

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yourself in and to die. He and Alex always tried

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to help people and had extra food and water to give. Well,

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that's nice, one of the good ones. I mean, we'll

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take the bare minimum. The bare minimum in as was

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so much worse. It's like actively destroyed, literally destroying water

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bottles that organizations leave there and yeah, so yeahh no,

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it's true. So they thought they could help her too.

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The women's feet were full of blisters, her lips so

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chapped and burned. They helped her get into their vehicle

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when they saw a boy walking toward them, then another

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and a little girl, then a boy that looked about sixteen,

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who looked injured. When the teen reached Juan and Alex,

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they were horrified to see that his arm was just

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hanging there, or whatever remained of his arm. His abdomen

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was also very injured. They called for a medical evacuation

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because the sixteen year old looked terrible. The helicopter arrived fast,

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but then the teen had died. By them was too late,

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he had lost too much blood because of the condition

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they found the group, Alex and Huan like they needed

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to help. They found out later that the teen's arm

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seemed to have been pulled off. They thought maybe this

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was the work of a coyote who hurt them in

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order to steal their money. Little did they know it

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was so much worse. Both Alex and Juan were dads,

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and they felt like if this was their children, they

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would help them and they needed to do the same.

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They went to the social worker in charge of the kids.

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She told them also at this point the kids were

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like in some shelter. Shelter yeah. So they went to

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the social worker in charge of the kids and she

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told them that the kids had woke up screaming and

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crying that night. She said the kids spoke of monsters.

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Kuan wasn't shocked after the state they found these kids in,

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but still he thought this was a horrible coyote who

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had abandoned the group. But then the kids were able

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to say what happened. When they stopped to rest for

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the night, they were woken up by screams. The adults

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tried to protect the kids. It was chaos. People were

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running and dying. Something was attacking the group. Buheto tried

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leading them away to a safer location, but something snatched

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him away. Then the seventeen year old whoops. Then the

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seventeen year old tried to protect the youngest until whatever

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that thing was tried snatching him. He was able to

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escape because the koyota was able to shoot the thing

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just before he died. The thing then went after the koyote,

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giving the kids a chance to run. Quan couldn't believe

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what he was hearing. Was there really a group hunting

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00:11:28.120 --> 00:11:30.240
migrants in the middle of the night. They were put

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00:11:30.279 --> 00:11:33.360
on overtime. After that, Quan and Alex had the night shift,

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and on their second shift they saw this thing for themselves.

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They were radioed that someone was running toward them from

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the north. When they saw the group, they could tell

218
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the group was running from something. Then they saw a

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border patrol unit behind them, but they weren't the ones

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chasing the group. The unit seemed to be firing behind

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them like they were covering the running group. When Juan

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and Alex reached the group and the other unit, they

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found out what was going on. The other officer told

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that some kind of animal had attacked this group. He

225
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fired at it, but it seemed to get more angry.

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The animal started attacking them, but it ran away when

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it saw Quan and Alex's vehicle approaching. They processed the

228
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group and went to a nearby bar together. They were

229
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all shaking up. They were talking about what happened the

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night when a Navajo police officer approached them. He overheard

231
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the conversation and asked if they could please describe this thing,

232
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this animal, in detail. The officer chugged his beer, asked

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for another, and then chugged that one. I would have too.

234
00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:36.759
Right then. He said it could have been some kind

235
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of wolf, but longer, and there were three of them,

236
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but only one was attacking them. The other two seemed

237
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to only try to chase the migrants away. The other

238
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two hid when he and his partner arrived. The third

239
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one didn't run away. It wasn't scared. They fired, but

240
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bullets didn't hurt. It sounds scary, yeah, can you. I

241
00:12:56.240 --> 00:12:58.679
can just picture all this, and I know that's why

242
00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:02.159
I was so scared because I was picturing it. It

243
00:13:02.200 --> 00:13:05.320
sounds like what like a movie? Oh, I thought you're

244
00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:07.120
gonna say what it was? Okay? Oh, do you not

245
00:13:07.240 --> 00:13:09.200
have any ideas, yeah, or you just gonna keep it?

246
00:13:09.200 --> 00:13:12.559
No way to end? Okay. These things look like a

247
00:13:12.600 --> 00:13:15.840
mix between a man and a wolf, like a war

248
00:13:15.960 --> 00:13:19.240
wolf from the movies, but it also seemed dead and

249
00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:24.360
smelled rotten. There seemed to be rotten flesh hanging on it.

250
00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:27.240
Its eyes were white. It growled at times, but other

251
00:13:27.320 --> 00:13:31.639
times it could imitate their voices. Ew, can I guess

252
00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:37.440
what you do? I'll keep going okay. His partner unloaded

253
00:13:37.480 --> 00:13:40.000
his whole clip, but it didn't FaZe the creature. It

254
00:13:40.039 --> 00:13:42.519
tried to rip their car door open. That's when they

255
00:13:42.519 --> 00:13:44.480
told the group to run. They would try and hold

256
00:13:44.480 --> 00:13:46.960
the thing off. They saw at least two fall and

257
00:13:47.080 --> 00:13:49.200
not get back up from the group, and the officer

258
00:13:49.320 --> 00:13:52.320
was shaking when he finished his story as what I

259
00:13:52.320 --> 00:13:57.639
I'm shaking. I'm shaking right now. My knees are buckling

260
00:13:57.679 --> 00:14:02.720
in falling from my chair. Okay. The Navajo officer went

261
00:14:02.759 --> 00:14:04.960
back to his friends, while Juan and Alex and the

262
00:14:05.000 --> 00:14:07.960
rest sat scared. They had not heard a story like this.

263
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The other officer broke the silence by asking the rest

264
00:14:11.200 --> 00:14:13.440
of them if they thought it was a nawan and

265
00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:16.480
if they had heard of Nowhalla's in Arizona. The Navajo

266
00:14:16.639 --> 00:14:19.240
officer shook his head. I thought, I thought the Navajo

267
00:14:19.279 --> 00:14:23.159
officer left. Oh he came back. I guess I don't know. Okay, Well, anyway,

268
00:14:23.840 --> 00:14:28.440
he never actually left. He turned around and he was

269
00:14:28.559 --> 00:14:31.399
right next to them. Yeah. Yeah, so he was still overhearing.

270
00:14:31.559 --> 00:14:34.080
I would be overhearing the whole conversation, so too, like

271
00:14:34.200 --> 00:14:38.120
this sounds good, let me Yeah. So the Navajo officer

272
00:14:38.200 --> 00:14:40.519
shook his head and told them a name none of

273
00:14:40.519 --> 00:14:43.480
them had heard before. He said, this was a similar

274
00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:47.240
being a shape shifter, only it didn't turn into common

275
00:14:47.279 --> 00:14:50.639
animals like pigs, dogs, donkeys, or goats. This was un

276
00:14:50.879 --> 00:14:54.080
Cambia Pieles, a skin walker. It didn't fear anyone. That

277
00:14:54.159 --> 00:14:57.080
was what I was guessing. Yeah. Yeah. At first I

278
00:14:57.279 --> 00:14:59.879
was like, oh, that's a nawhal And then they disc

279
00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:02.720
I've been more detailed, like the rotting and flesh, and

280
00:15:02.799 --> 00:15:05.159
then I was like, oh no, it made me. The

281
00:15:05.320 --> 00:15:07.080
reason I thought of it was because it's kind of

282
00:15:07.159 --> 00:15:10.759
like in Bad Cree how they described the window. Go oh, yeah,

283
00:15:10.799 --> 00:15:12.720
and you've read that. I still need to read it

284
00:15:12.759 --> 00:15:15.519
to Bad Kree. Probably the best book I've read all year.

285
00:15:15.559 --> 00:15:19.000
Oh okay ye, I need to read it. And this

286
00:15:19.039 --> 00:15:23.159
one was even more sinister. It seemed to like to

287
00:15:23.240 --> 00:15:25.480
kill and eat people. It had to have sacrificed a

288
00:15:25.559 --> 00:15:28.840
family member to become this powerful. The only way to

289
00:15:28.919 --> 00:15:31.759
stop it was for someone it knew to call its

290
00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:34.320
real name. There was no other way to heard it.

291
00:15:34.399 --> 00:15:36.919
That's so scary, like, how do you know? How do

292
00:15:36.960 --> 00:15:41.759
you find someone knows it? Ooh? They drank in silence

293
00:15:41.799 --> 00:15:45.279
after that, Juan went home wondering who could actually know

294
00:15:45.360 --> 00:15:48.039
such an evil creature. On their next night shift, they

295
00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:51.080
felt so defeated. Then they heard screaming and drove as

296
00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:53.360
fast as they could, but by the time they got there,

297
00:15:53.559 --> 00:15:56.960
no one was alive. This kept happening over the next week.

298
00:15:57.240 --> 00:16:00.120
The officers that had shot at it turned up dead too.

299
00:16:00.759 --> 00:16:03.159
When Quana and Alex arrived at the scene, it was

300
00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:06.519
a mess. Quanna threw up. They couldn't even recognize the

301
00:16:06.679 --> 00:16:10.279
other officers. It ended up being a closed casket funeral,

302
00:16:10.600 --> 00:16:13.600
and the whole squad was afraid. After that, they were

303
00:16:13.720 --> 00:16:17.799
under instructions to protect themselves first, then rescue migrants. So

304
00:16:18.080 --> 00:16:20.399
creature was on the loose and they were in its

305
00:16:20.480 --> 00:16:24.000
hunting grounds. It's like messing with them. Yeah, like I

306
00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:26.919
feel like it knew them by that point, and yeah, yeah,

307
00:16:27.000 --> 00:16:30.799
by name. Probably. On the night of November eighth, nineteen

308
00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:33.879
ninety three, they received a call from Outposts four. It

309
00:16:33.960 --> 00:16:37.399
was about the christ of a boy. They were half

310
00:16:37.399 --> 00:16:39.559
a mile away and it was vital to reach him

311
00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:42.200
before he froze to death. The knights in the desert

312
00:16:42.279 --> 00:16:45.840
were cold. Luckily, Quanta and Alex found him. Oh, I

313
00:16:45.840 --> 00:16:48.559
thought it was a fake boy. Who oh, no, this

314
00:16:48.600 --> 00:16:52.960
is a real boy. Something that's good, better than the alternative. Yeah,

315
00:16:53.480 --> 00:16:56.159
the boy was terrified. It turns out he was not

316
00:16:56.279 --> 00:16:58.919
a migrant. He was a student. His class had been

317
00:16:58.960 --> 00:17:01.399
on the way back from a train to Monument Valley.

318
00:17:01.720 --> 00:17:04.359
Now they had to find the bus. Their only clue

319
00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:05.920
was that the bus was on the way to the

320
00:17:05.960 --> 00:17:08.880
city and had overturned while making it left. No one

321
00:17:09.000 --> 00:17:11.319
was hurt from the crash, but when the bus driver

322
00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:13.559
and one of the teachers jumped down to check on

323
00:17:13.599 --> 00:17:17.079
the bus, they didn't return. The kids could hear weird

324
00:17:17.839 --> 00:17:21.200
noises outside. One of the other teachers decided to take

325
00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:23.559
the rest of the kids to play. Buy some giant rocks.

326
00:17:23.839 --> 00:17:26.240
That's some jeepers. Creepers. Shit, that's what made me think

327
00:17:26.680 --> 00:17:29.559
back inside the bus, why would they leave the bus right?

328
00:17:31.240 --> 00:17:33.480
So yeah, one of the other teachers decided to take

329
00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:35.519
the rest of the kids to play by some giant rocks.

330
00:17:35.759 --> 00:17:38.160
But this boy hit in the bus. He then heard

331
00:17:38.200 --> 00:17:41.920
screaming and crying, and that's how God led screaming for help.

332
00:17:42.119 --> 00:17:46.279
Oh Man, Alex and Kuana called for backup whoever could come,

333
00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:50.279
including local police and the Navaja police. They desperately searched

334
00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:54.039
and searched. It seemed hopeless until they came across the bus.

335
00:17:54.400 --> 00:17:57.200
They continued to search until they heard Alex scream there

336
00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:00.559
were about twenty five kids, all dead. They had been

337
00:18:00.559 --> 00:18:02.880
attacked by the creature. But the boys said there were

338
00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:08.039
forty kids, not twenty five. Then two actual coyotes, not kayotas.

339
00:18:08.680 --> 00:18:13.319
Yes the animal, not the yes. Employ your employee, not

340
00:18:13.400 --> 00:18:17.240
the job. Then two actual coyotes came out of the shadows.

341
00:18:17.319 --> 00:18:19.640
The officers were ready to fire at them, but the

342
00:18:19.759 --> 00:18:23.119
Navajo officer told them to stop. He approached the coyotes and,

343
00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:26.119
to everyone's surprised, they could talk. The Navajo officer came

344
00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:28.119
back to the group and told them the creature was

345
00:18:28.160 --> 00:18:30.559
their son. They had been trying to stop him, but

346
00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:33.599
their son told them he couldn't, that no one respected

347
00:18:33.640 --> 00:18:36.279
the old ways and he needed to stop them. The

348
00:18:36.359 --> 00:18:39.119
pair said they would help, as only they knew the

349
00:18:39.160 --> 00:18:42.599
creature's real name. They searched for it together, shooting at

350
00:18:42.640 --> 00:18:45.119
it when they found it, and like before, nothing was

351
00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:47.839
able to hurt it, not until the pair of coyotes

352
00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:50.839
turned into an old couple and began calling the creature's

353
00:18:50.839 --> 00:18:53.960
real name. They called and called until the bullets were

354
00:18:53.960 --> 00:18:56.799
able to hurt the creature. Officers kept firing until the

355
00:18:56.799 --> 00:19:00.799
creature was gone. There was nothing but a pile of ashes.

356
00:19:01.160 --> 00:19:03.519
It was over. Alex and Juan had no idea how

357
00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:05.759
to even begin to write this report, but the Navajo

358
00:19:05.880 --> 00:19:07.960
officers did they would take care of it. This happened

359
00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:11.160
early in Juan's career. He knows it sounds unbelievable, but

360
00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:14.160
even thirty years later, recounting the events of the night

361
00:19:14.279 --> 00:19:18.720
shakes him to his core. Wow wow, wow, man, intents,

362
00:19:19.759 --> 00:19:25.720
that was intense. Also in Bad Crey, the windigo like

363
00:19:25.839 --> 00:19:29.880
feeds off of, like the trauma and hurt of all

364
00:19:30.039 --> 00:19:34.359
the people that it basically takes over. So I don't know,

365
00:19:34.400 --> 00:19:38.160
it's like a different depiction. Yeah. Interesting, Okay, I really

366
00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:40.599
have to read that, Yeah you do. I was holding

367
00:19:40.640 --> 00:19:42.839
my breath to that story. It's why I didn't interrupt

368
00:19:42.920 --> 00:19:46.599
as much. Yeah, I will say when I was looking

369
00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:48.640
up like Windigo stuff, I did see that. I mean,

370
00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:50.599
the story is already out there, so I don't think

371
00:19:50.640 --> 00:19:53.480
it's a huge deal, but I did see that a

372
00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:56.240
lot of I think because Windigoes are not like a

373
00:19:56.279 --> 00:19:59.759
belief in all Native American cultures, right, but in the

374
00:19:59.799 --> 00:20:02.000
one that do believe in the Windygo, they kind of

375
00:20:02.039 --> 00:20:06.559
don't like other non Indigenous people talking about the Windygo

376
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:09.000
because it's always depicted as something evil, you know what

377
00:20:09.079 --> 00:20:11.799
I mean. But I mean the story is out there,

378
00:20:11.839 --> 00:20:15.160
so yeah, like the some people have asked us to

379
00:20:15.200 --> 00:20:17.440
cover because it's like a lot along the border, this

380
00:20:17.640 --> 00:20:19.480
legend is told, but it's like, I don't feel like

381
00:20:19.519 --> 00:20:22.799
it's my place. We're not telling the legend. Yeah, yeah,

382
00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:27.160
it's like telling a story of a Mexican American Border

383
00:20:27.160 --> 00:20:30.720
Patrol agent who experienced this allegedly, right because it was

384
00:20:30.759 --> 00:20:33.519
sent into that other channel. But my point in all

385
00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:37.279
this is like, just like Nawilas themselves in like those stories,

386
00:20:37.559 --> 00:20:40.400
there's like good ones and bad ones. You know, it's

387
00:20:40.400 --> 00:20:44.359
like up to the individual person that's doing this thing,

388
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:48.279
but it's something that has been so twisted and misconstrued

389
00:20:48.319 --> 00:20:53.759
and changed, and so yeah, I personally would never be like, well,

390
00:20:53.799 --> 00:20:57.319
the legend of the skin wall, like you know, but

391
00:20:57.440 --> 00:20:59.759
the story I felt like we could share because I

392
00:20:59.759 --> 00:21:03.279
guess I just wanted to throw that out there. Oh no, yeah,

393
00:21:03.279 --> 00:21:05.079
I mean too. And then another thing I was gonna say,

394
00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:08.759
since we're doing this right now already, the person that

395
00:21:08.839 --> 00:21:12.720
wrote the story that experienced it, that's the term he used.

396
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:14.559
I think a lot of people don't use navajo. They

397
00:21:14.599 --> 00:21:18.759
use like DNA. Now yeah, yeah, but you know, we

398
00:21:18.759 --> 00:21:21.480
we've just translated it the way it was in English.

399
00:21:21.519 --> 00:21:24.880
It's like in American English they called them navajo, but

400
00:21:25.480 --> 00:21:28.200
they were for tool and I think actually that came

401
00:21:28.200 --> 00:21:32.400
from the Spanish and the original term means like poors thief. Yeah,

402
00:21:32.440 --> 00:21:35.759
it's like not good, no, right, so but like we

403
00:21:35.839 --> 00:21:39.400
know it's d NE right or people will say DNA,

404
00:21:39.599 --> 00:21:42.200
which isn't I guess in English if you're saying it.

405
00:21:42.200 --> 00:21:44.799
But yeah, like you know, just wanted to say that too.

406
00:21:45.079 --> 00:21:47.400
But that's like a little like mini reign of terror,

407
00:21:47.559 --> 00:21:50.480
just like terrorizing the I mean it was scary at once,

408
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:53.559
just kind of like I would I would have quit

409
00:21:53.880 --> 00:21:57.200
that night, that first night, like oh yeah, oh man, Okay,

410
00:21:57.279 --> 00:21:59.200
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A Spooky and we're back. We're just gonna jump right

444
00:23:54.680 --> 00:23:58.039
into my part. On March third, nineteen thirty one, two

445
00:23:58.119 --> 00:24:01.559
teens in Laredo, Texas cross paths in a way that

446
00:24:01.640 --> 00:24:06.000
changed their lives forever. One was largely forgotten and the

447
00:24:06.039 --> 00:24:08.599
other lived a full life and then went on to

448
00:24:08.680 --> 00:24:11.680
head the US Board Patrol and the National Rival Association.

449
00:24:12.400 --> 00:24:19.039
Oh my god. Yeah, I'm sharing the murder of Ramon Gaciano.

450
00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:22.200
And if you listened to our history podcast, it's a

451
00:24:22.440 --> 00:24:26.000
known We literally talked a little bit about this yesterday.

452
00:24:26.039 --> 00:24:28.720
This is just in more detail because yeah, we touched

453
00:24:28.759 --> 00:24:32.640
on it briefly on the you know, Operation Wetback episode.

454
00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:38.039
So on March third, Harlan B. Carter got home from

455
00:24:38.039 --> 00:24:41.880
school and saw that his mom, Ila Carter was in distress.

456
00:24:42.480 --> 00:24:45.400
She was scared and nervous because she saw a group

457
00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:52.359
of Mexicans near their property. And yeah, it's safe to youla, Yeah,

458
00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:54.680
it's safe to assume that she was racist. I mean,

459
00:24:54.680 --> 00:24:58.640
this is nineteen thirty one and she's scared because Mexicans

460
00:24:58.680 --> 00:25:03.720
walked by her house. Her house, stupid. And it didn't

461
00:25:03.759 --> 00:25:06.799
help that three weeks before this, the Carter family car

462
00:25:06.839 --> 00:25:10.119
had been stolen. That could have been anyone, Yeah, that

463
00:25:10.160 --> 00:25:13.519
could have been anyone. But she told Harlan that she

464
00:25:13.680 --> 00:25:18.400
thought the Mexicans had something to do with it, and

465
00:25:19.319 --> 00:25:24.440
Papa Carter wouldn't be home for another hour, Papa Carter. Yeah,

466
00:25:24.680 --> 00:25:28.240
Carter Senior wouldn't be home for another hour. He worked

467
00:25:28.279 --> 00:25:38.079
long hours as a border patrol officer. Wow, like Papa Eissan. Yeah.

468
00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:45.240
So side note, Papa Carter did believe I don't know

469
00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:51.279
his first name. I did write. Okay, what's so what

470
00:25:51.319 --> 00:25:56.119
about Bat Carter? Papa? Sorry, Papa. So they left a

471
00:25:56.200 --> 00:26:01.359
small town, Grandberry, Texas, very white, tiny, little world town.

472
00:26:01.480 --> 00:26:06.000
They left that for Laredo, Texas, on the border, highly

473
00:26:06.640 --> 00:26:10.119
large Mexican population. This was at this time, very not

474
00:26:10.359 --> 00:26:13.640
that long ago Mexico still right, right, that could explain

475
00:26:13.640 --> 00:26:19.359
all the Mexicans they were here. Yeah, but he moved

476
00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:22.200
to this town as a word patrol agent, believing that

477
00:26:22.400 --> 00:26:26.559
Laredo needed a full scale house cleaning because there were

478
00:26:26.559 --> 00:26:30.960
too many Mexicans there. There's too many Mexicans somewhere where

479
00:26:31.279 --> 00:26:36.279
it was Mexico before. Okay, okay, So it's like the

480
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:42.359
quote unquote expats moving to Sinaloa or Latinaoa is tandangerous

481
00:26:43.119 --> 00:26:47.720
or was it? I think so? I think it was

482
00:26:47.759 --> 00:26:53.279
a Capulco where getting married the bandas at the beach. Yeah, like,

483
00:26:53.559 --> 00:26:57.599
how are you going to move somewhere with Mexicans and

484
00:26:57.599 --> 00:27:04.759
the Mexicans. Yeah, users literal same energy. Okay, so back

485
00:27:04.799 --> 00:27:08.640
to this. Oh and of course, like you know, children

486
00:27:08.720 --> 00:27:10.680
take on the beliefs of their parents most of the time,

487
00:27:10.720 --> 00:27:14.079
not all of them, but Harlan Carter did, so he

488
00:27:14.200 --> 00:27:19.200
had the same animosity towards Mexicans in a largely Mexican

489
00:27:19.240 --> 00:27:25.680
town that was Mexico, right right, we'll keep saying. Anyway,

490
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:28.400
knowing that his dad would to be home for hours,

491
00:27:28.440 --> 00:27:30.680
Harlan Carter felt like he needed to take care of

492
00:27:30.680 --> 00:27:33.279
this himself and help his mom, and so he told

493
00:27:33.319 --> 00:27:34.720
his mom he was going to go see if he

494
00:27:34.759 --> 00:27:36.680
could get them to come talk to her to clear

495
00:27:36.759 --> 00:27:38.920
this up, like to see if they did steal the

496
00:27:39.160 --> 00:27:44.000
family car or not, which is already who would admit

497
00:27:44.039 --> 00:27:47.799
to that anyway. Yeah, I will say though, in Oakland

498
00:27:47.839 --> 00:27:52.160
when we were babies, the van got stolen. Oh yeah,

499
00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:55.119
and our dad went looking around and he found the

500
00:27:55.960 --> 00:28:00.319
kids had taken it cruising around and he was like, oh,

501
00:28:00.359 --> 00:28:02.319
we just they just literally said, oh, yeah, we have

502
00:28:02.400 --> 00:28:04.920
your van. We dumped out the baby seats, they're like

503
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:07.759
back there and they returned the van. That sure they

504
00:28:07.799 --> 00:28:10.920
didn't do that. So I guess I could work, so

505
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:21.920
some people might anyway, So he was gonna His plan

506
00:28:22.039 --> 00:28:24.039
was to force them to return to their house to

507
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:29.960
question them, which is already odd anyway, So he grabbed

508
00:28:29.960 --> 00:28:34.640
his shotgun and headed out. He found the Mexican teens

509
00:28:34.680 --> 00:28:38.160
over by the nearby swimming hole. The youngest was twelve,

510
00:28:38.359 --> 00:28:41.960
and then the oldest was fifteen year old Ramon, and

511
00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:46.200
so Harlan confronted them, accusing them of stealing the car. Ramon,

512
00:28:46.319 --> 00:28:48.359
being the oldest, did all the talking and he's like, no,

513
00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:51.599
we don't know anything about that. That wasn't us. Harlan

514
00:28:51.680 --> 00:28:55.559
demanded that they come back to the property with him.

515
00:28:55.720 --> 00:28:59.200
When the boys asked why, why why would we go

516
00:28:59.279 --> 00:29:03.200
with you? Yeah, he didn't say Harlan curR didn't say.

517
00:29:03.440 --> 00:29:06.680
So that's when Ramon told him, Hello, we won't go

518
00:29:06.759 --> 00:29:08.960
to your house and you can't make us. And then

519
00:29:09.160 --> 00:29:12.720
Harlan and Dramon started swearing at each other. Ramon pulled

520
00:29:12.759 --> 00:29:15.839
out his knife, which I don't blame him for. Like,

521
00:29:16.240 --> 00:29:19.279
I mean, here's someone threatening you, are trying to like

522
00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:22.839
force you to do something. Yeah, who came out of nowhere?

523
00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:27.680
Disrupted you swimming? Yeah? Like to me, that is self defense,

524
00:29:28.799 --> 00:29:32.759
not Harlan coming up to them. Legally, it's not self

525
00:29:32.759 --> 00:29:37.200
defense yet. No, but I see what you're saying, right right,

526
00:29:37.519 --> 00:29:42.279
But certainly Harlan confronts of the boys is not self defense.

527
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:46.319
It'll come back anyway, Okay, yeah, I mean no, that's

528
00:29:46.359 --> 00:29:49.359
starting though something. Yeah, you're starting. You're literally starting to

529
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:53.400
fight at that point, right anyway, So he pulled out

530
00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:56.640
his knife and asked Harlan if he wanted a fight, which, yeah,

531
00:29:56.680 --> 00:29:59.440
like clear the error between the both of you without

532
00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:02.759
anyone I was jumping in. I shouldn't. He shouldn't have

533
00:30:02.759 --> 00:30:05.039
pulled out the knife. But that doesn't warning like someone

534
00:30:05.079 --> 00:30:08.440
shooting at you. So no, of course not so. Then

535
00:30:08.519 --> 00:30:13.440
Harln lifted his gun and pointed it like touching Ramon's chest.

536
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:16.599
Ramon told him calmly, don't do it and pushed the

537
00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:20.640
shotgun to the side, so still keeping his cool. Then

538
00:30:20.799 --> 00:30:24.880
Harlan took a step back and laughed and then said

539
00:30:24.920 --> 00:30:27.000
you think I won't do it, And then he lifted

540
00:30:27.039 --> 00:30:29.880
his shotgun again and pointed it at Ramon's chest and

541
00:30:29.880 --> 00:30:36.279
fired wow, and Dramon fell to the ground almost instantly died.

542
00:30:36.440 --> 00:30:38.960
There was a two inch wound in his chest. Well,

543
00:30:39.000 --> 00:30:43.039
he was so close to him. Yeah. Wow. And surprisingly

544
00:30:43.119 --> 00:30:46.519
for the time, Harlan was arrested and he went to trial.

545
00:30:46.720 --> 00:30:50.160
Dramon's twelve year old friend sal was the one who testified,

546
00:30:50.200 --> 00:30:52.640
and that's why we know what happened that day. That's

547
00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:56.440
his testimony of what happened. And Harlan's lawyers tried saying

548
00:30:56.480 --> 00:30:59.599
that he fired in self defense. But he went over there,

549
00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:03.519
he went over there and he picked a fight. Yeah,

550
00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:06.119
and Ramon he hadn't tried to stab him. He was

551
00:31:06.200 --> 00:31:09.599
just holding the knife. Yeah, and he even like moved

552
00:31:10.160 --> 00:31:12.480
the gun over and told him, like, don't do this. Yeah,

553
00:31:13.359 --> 00:31:18.279
and so yeah, they said Ramon was holding the knife

554
00:31:18.319 --> 00:31:20.480
in his right hand and that Harlan only meant to

555
00:31:20.480 --> 00:31:22.519
shoot him in the right arm to disable him. But

556
00:31:22.559 --> 00:31:25.759
Sadabad's testimony said otherwise, because Ramon had been holding the

557
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:29.319
knife in his left hand and Harlan never even aimed

558
00:31:29.319 --> 00:31:32.319
at anything but Ramon's chest. He wrote that he was

559
00:31:32.359 --> 00:31:36.240
holding in his right hand. Ummm no, no, no. The

560
00:31:37.039 --> 00:31:39.839
Harlan's defense said that it was in his right hand,

561
00:31:39.960 --> 00:31:44.440
but Salvador said it within his left. Oh god, I

562
00:31:44.480 --> 00:31:47.039
got it. My bad, my bad. Yeah. So yeah, it's

563
00:31:47.079 --> 00:31:50.599
clearly not self defense, even the way that his lawyers

564
00:31:50.599 --> 00:31:54.680
were trying to spin it. No. Yeah, after ninety hours

565
00:31:54.720 --> 00:31:59.039
of deliberation, the jury found seventeen year old Harlan Carter

566
00:31:59.119 --> 00:32:04.000
guilty for the murder of Ramon. Wow, I mean, I

567
00:32:04.720 --> 00:32:09.079
I'm guilty. Yeah. So they took their time debating, Yeah,

568
00:32:09.640 --> 00:32:12.880
you know, ninety hours. But yeah, I'm very surprised because

569
00:32:12.880 --> 00:32:14.880
this is nineteen thirty one. This is at a time

570
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:18.440
in Texas where they were literally like lyning Mexicans. Yeah,

571
00:32:18.559 --> 00:32:21.839
left and right. I mean the Texas Rangers were going

572
00:32:21.880 --> 00:32:26.519
through and massacred. That's actually on my topic list that

573
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:30.599
pot of been need massacre anyway. So yeah, guilty of

574
00:32:30.720 --> 00:32:35.160
murder without malice afterthought was the charge, and because of

575
00:32:35.160 --> 00:32:37.519
his age, he was sentenced to three years in prison.

576
00:32:37.720 --> 00:32:41.920
But on December twenty third, nineteen thirty one, Harlan's lawyers appealed,

577
00:32:42.279 --> 00:32:45.000
citing that the judge failed to submit to the jury

578
00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:49.759
the appropriate instructions upon the law of self defense. Does

579
00:32:49.799 --> 00:32:55.160
that make sense? Say that again? Okay, So basically they're

580
00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:58.720
saying that the judge failed to explain the law of

581
00:32:58.720 --> 00:33:01.599
self defense to the Turth jury. And the issuald had

582
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:05.519
been explained what the law of self defense is, got it?

583
00:33:05.640 --> 00:33:08.400
Got it? And because they didn't know what that law was,

584
00:33:08.480 --> 00:33:10.799
that's why they found him guilty. Right, although like in

585
00:33:10.839 --> 00:33:13.480
any sense, I don't I still don't think it self defense,

586
00:33:14.039 --> 00:33:17.839
it's not really because he wasn't being at, didn't try

587
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:22.079
to stab him. Yeah. So yeah, like I feel like

588
00:33:22.119 --> 00:33:24.880
at that point it could have been de escalated still

589
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:28.680
and he chose to just start shooting. Yeah, yeah, Yeah.

590
00:33:28.720 --> 00:33:33.799
So the appeal was successful and Harlan Carter only served

591
00:33:33.839 --> 00:33:36.880
two years of his three year sentence. There was never

592
00:33:37.200 --> 00:33:41.559
any evidence linking the three Mexican boys to the Carter's

593
00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:45.440
Carter family stolen car. That's the thing, Like if he

594
00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:48.599
hadn't gone in just assumed these Mexican kids that had

595
00:33:48.640 --> 00:33:51.000
nothing to do with that, probably if he hadn't just

596
00:33:51.039 --> 00:33:54.319
assumed they did that, like this would have never happened,

597
00:33:54.599 --> 00:33:59.000
exactly exactly. So he still went out looking for a

598
00:33:59.039 --> 00:34:02.119
fight over something that he couldn't even like, didn't even

599
00:34:02.160 --> 00:34:04.960
know something that was unproven. Yeah yeah, you don't mean

600
00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:08.760
like he was just making racist assumptions assuming it was them. Yeah,

601
00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:15.000
just like his mom and her son and his daddy,

602
00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:22.760
the lot of them, death, death to them all, like winding. No.

603
00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:27.519
But yeah, that is all that's known about Ramon that

604
00:34:27.599 --> 00:34:29.719
when he was fifteen he was killed by seventeen year

605
00:34:29.719 --> 00:34:33.440
old Harlan Carter. There's no record of you know, who

606
00:34:33.440 --> 00:34:36.719
his parents were, what he liked for the aspire to be.

607
00:34:37.199 --> 00:34:39.440
There's not even a picture of him. My god, that's

608
00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:42.800
so sad. Yeah, but we know who the fuck is

609
00:34:42.920 --> 00:34:48.159
murderer is of course. Yeah, Harlan Carter was able to

610
00:34:48.280 --> 00:34:51.880
enroll at the University of Texas after his release, uh

611
00:34:52.039 --> 00:34:55.880
then the Emory University School of Law. And he was

612
00:34:55.880 --> 00:35:00.159
not done terrorizing Mexicans because in nineteen thirty six he

613
00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:02.599
got a job with his daddy at Border Patrol, a

614
00:35:02.719 --> 00:35:07.000
NEPO baby Border Patrol Nebo baby, a NEPO Border Patrol agent,

615
00:35:08.360 --> 00:35:12.199
yep wow, and he rose through the ranks. He was

616
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:15.280
in charge of Border Patrol from nineteen fifty to nineteen

617
00:35:15.320 --> 00:35:19.599
fifty seven. And like we said in our Operation Wetback episode,

618
00:35:19.679 --> 00:35:24.199
he actually proposed the plan Operation Cloud Bursts, which was

619
00:35:24.239 --> 00:35:27.400
the predecessor to Operation Wetback, which we go into detail

620
00:35:27.440 --> 00:35:30.480
ani Storia as a known our history podcast, but basically

621
00:35:30.519 --> 00:35:34.360
This was the mass deportation of Mexicans and Mexican citizen

622
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:38.480
Mexican Americans, and it was bad. And this man who

623
00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:42.599
murdered a fifteen year old Mexican for no reason goes

624
00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:46.440
behind it all. And then many, many, many, many Mexicans

625
00:35:46.480 --> 00:35:49.559
and Mexican American Mexican Americans went on to die as

626
00:35:49.599 --> 00:35:53.480
a result from operation went back. Yeah, so fuck this

627
00:35:53.599 --> 00:35:56.159
man who would have never even created this had he

628
00:35:56.239 --> 00:35:59.519
not been placed or rose through the ranks because of

629
00:35:59.599 --> 00:36:05.119
never to Like, what do you have, you mediocre man?

630
00:36:05.880 --> 00:36:08.800
You would be nothing without an epotism. Yeah, because, yeah,

631
00:36:08.880 --> 00:36:11.239
his dad got him a job at Bard Patrol because

632
00:36:11.239 --> 00:36:14.760
he was a border patrol agent. And then Harlan Carter

633
00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:19.000
also joined the National Board of the NRA in nineteen

634
00:36:19.000 --> 00:36:22.119
fifty one and he rose through those rinks too. How

635
00:36:22.199 --> 00:36:26.239
much he became. Can this man do? And you know,

636
00:36:26.559 --> 00:36:32.559
for real, he's not done because uh he was a

637
00:36:32.599 --> 00:36:35.760
president only from nineteen sixty five to nineteen sixty seven

638
00:36:35.920 --> 00:36:38.599
of the NRA, but then he became the director of

639
00:36:38.639 --> 00:36:42.280
the lobbying arm of the NRA. Thank you for the

640
00:36:42.280 --> 00:36:45.360
mass shooting, sir. He is literally the reason that the

641
00:36:45.440 --> 00:36:48.360
NRA is the way it is today because fucking back

642
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:53.239
way back when it was uh, it was just like cool. Yeah,

643
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:55.800
it was a little more normal. It was just to

644
00:36:55.840 --> 00:37:00.480
teach gun safety. Yeah, this man changed it. Yeah, ruined

645
00:37:00.519 --> 00:37:06.199
our lives. Yeah, in all of America. All. Yeah. He

646
00:37:06.239 --> 00:37:08.880
had been a card carrying member of the NRA since

647
00:37:08.920 --> 00:37:12.159
age sixteen, a year before killing Dramon Gaziano. Oh my god.

648
00:37:12.960 --> 00:37:15.519
And then he would end up becoming the executive vice

649
00:37:15.559 --> 00:37:20.079
president until nineteen eighty five. He earned the nickname bullet

650
00:37:20.119 --> 00:37:25.159
Heead disgusting, disgusting, Yeah, and pushed the NRA into the

651
00:37:25.239 --> 00:37:28.480
organization that it is today, a true believer in zero

652
00:37:28.639 --> 00:37:33.519
gun legislation, my guns, and he essentially coined the term

653
00:37:33.679 --> 00:37:36.559
guns don't kill people. People kill people, which yeah he

654
00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:40.360
knows about because he killed someone, right, Yeah, guns don't

655
00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:46.119
kill people. Harlan kills people. Harlan kills Mexicans, yes, yes, yeah.

656
00:37:46.280 --> 00:37:49.960
When the Laredo Times broke the story of the murder,

657
00:37:50.159 --> 00:37:53.199
which was unknown at that point, Harlan denied all of it.

658
00:37:53.280 --> 00:37:55.760
He tried to say it wasn't him. He's like, no, no, no,

659
00:37:55.800 --> 00:37:59.440
that Harlan was spelled with an A. I'm Harlan with

660
00:37:59.480 --> 00:38:02.360
an Oh, that's not me. But he changed the way,

661
00:38:02.400 --> 00:38:05.599
he changed his spelling purpose Yeah, after his release and

662
00:38:05.679 --> 00:38:09.840
a very in a very brock Turner manner. Wow wow

663
00:38:09.880 --> 00:38:12.440
wow wow. But then he would go on to tell

664
00:38:12.480 --> 00:38:14.559
the New York Times that he had nothing to hide

665
00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:18.360
and he wasn't going to rehash anything that was already

666
00:38:18.360 --> 00:38:20.239
over or anything that didn't have to do with the

667
00:38:20.360 --> 00:38:23.320
NRA because also side note, during this time, he was

668
00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:27.400
on trial for possibly stealing a bunch of ammunition from

669
00:38:27.440 --> 00:38:31.280
Border Patrol after he retired for personal use. I believe it, oh,

670
00:38:31.320 --> 00:38:33.960
one hundred percent, and it has everything to do with it,

671
00:38:34.039 --> 00:38:37.000
Like you were trigger happy then you killed an innocent

672
00:38:37.320 --> 00:38:41.880
teenager and you're still trigger happy now. And he stole

673
00:38:42.360 --> 00:38:45.039
emmo from the Border Patrol. You were only there because

674
00:38:45.039 --> 00:38:48.159
of your daddy, yes, and his Border Patrol buddies he

675
00:38:48.280 --> 00:38:55.519
placed on the board of RA of course, more nepotism. Wow.

676
00:38:56.840 --> 00:38:59.440
Then it just became impossible to deny that he was

677
00:38:59.480 --> 00:39:03.239
the same heart living carter that murder Dramon Gatiano. And

678
00:39:03.280 --> 00:39:06.519
so then he said, I continue to regret the incident deeply,

679
00:39:06.639 --> 00:39:10.920
as would anyone where a fatality is involved, very such

680
00:39:10.960 --> 00:39:15.320
a passive way, like a fatal fatality is involved. Not

681
00:39:15.519 --> 00:39:19.679
I cause a fatality. I killed someone. No where there

682
00:39:19.800 --> 00:39:25.000
was someone died happened, Yeah, a murder happened. Mm hmm.

683
00:39:25.480 --> 00:39:30.199
The gun was shot whatever the word is trigger A

684
00:39:30.320 --> 00:39:35.559
gun was somehow fired, fired, and someone died. And I

685
00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:40.280
regret that. No one knows. Yeah, it was my fault.

686
00:39:40.639 --> 00:39:45.159
What a non apology. Yeah, I'm sorry you feel that way.

687
00:39:45.159 --> 00:39:49.360
That about the way that I killed someone, bitch. Please.

688
00:39:50.480 --> 00:39:56.280
And So while Dramone's life was taken ended, Harlan changed

689
00:39:56.280 --> 00:39:59.719
the way the NRA functions. He changed the way Border

690
00:39:59.719 --> 00:40:05.480
Patrol operates. It operates now ruined all of our lives. Yeah,

691
00:40:05.519 --> 00:40:07.840
he got married, He had two sons who also went

692
00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:15.159
on to join Border Patrol. Boutism generational. Yeah. And when

693
00:40:15.159 --> 00:40:17.079
he died in nineteen ninety one, he was called, what

694
00:40:17.119 --> 00:40:23.039
are the NRA's most fierce warriors? Fuck you the Barbetual

695
00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:25.719
and the NRA and your sons and your mom and

696
00:40:25.760 --> 00:40:31.280
your dad. Wow. And there's actually I didn't know this.

697
00:40:31.360 --> 00:40:33.920
I was trying to find more information about Ramon Gaciano

698
00:40:33.960 --> 00:40:37.800
and basically my sources, I'll try to remember to link them.

699
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:39.360
I put them in my notes so that I can

700
00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:41.960
just copy and paste them. But all my sources basically

701
00:40:42.000 --> 00:40:45.199
just say, sadly, we know nothing about Ramon Giano, but

702
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:48.639
we know everything about fucking Harlan Carter. Wow. But there's

703
00:40:48.679 --> 00:40:52.360
a song named Ramon Gaciano. It came out in twenty

704
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:56.920
sixteen by the Drive By Truckers. I don't know who

705
00:40:56.920 --> 00:40:59.599
they were, but let me read you some of the lyrics. Okay,

706
00:40:59.599 --> 00:41:01.320
wait before are you read the lyrics? Like? What is

707
00:41:01.519 --> 00:41:04.599
is this country? It's this rock? What is this? Oh? Yeah,

708
00:41:04.760 --> 00:41:08.880
like a folksy song? Like yeah, like a rock. I'll

709
00:41:08.920 --> 00:41:11.519
tell let me read you really quick because I didn't

710
00:41:11.559 --> 00:41:18.119
write down Drive By Truckers. Okay, let's see the Drive

711
00:41:18.199 --> 00:41:22.360
By Truckers are an American rock band based in Athens, Georgia.

712
00:41:22.800 --> 00:41:28.119
They have roots in Richmond, Virginia. Let's say musical style. Oh,

713
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:33.480
they rock and roll, southern rock, country punk rock, cowpunk, pop, punk, blues, soul,

714
00:41:34.239 --> 00:41:36.960
southern soul. What are you doing? I just wanted to

715
00:41:37.000 --> 00:41:39.480
listen because I can't picture it with you to play.

716
00:41:39.480 --> 00:41:42.960
It took too long. It's taking too long to start.

717
00:41:44.159 --> 00:42:18.199
It's starting now. Sounds kind of country. Yeah, how much

718
00:42:18.239 --> 00:42:20.840
of it are you going to? I was gonna say

719
00:42:20.960 --> 00:42:23.440
one of the comments, has goodness, gracious a toe tapper?

720
00:42:23.519 --> 00:42:28.440
There ever was one? Oh my god, weird saying that,

721
00:42:29.639 --> 00:42:34.400
goodness gracious a toe tapper? There ever was one. I

722
00:42:34.440 --> 00:42:40.599
love that. But here's some of the lyrics. It all

723
00:42:40.639 --> 00:42:44.159
started with the border and that's still where it is today.

724
00:42:44.320 --> 00:42:47.400
Someone killed Ramon Casiano and the killer got away. He

725
00:42:47.480 --> 00:42:50.760
became a border agent and supplemented what he made with

726
00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:54.880
creative deportation and missing AMMO. By the case, the killing

727
00:42:54.920 --> 00:42:58.639
has been the bullets business since since back in nineteen

728
00:42:58.679 --> 00:43:03.519
thirty one killed Ramon and Ramon still ain't dead enough.

729
00:43:04.039 --> 00:43:08.400
Damn deep some of the comments behind the bastwards anyone,

730
00:43:09.199 --> 00:43:11.519
Oh yeah, I mentioned it and on its side doesn't

731
00:43:11.519 --> 00:43:15.199
know that they did a two part uh two parter

732
00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:17.880
on Harlan Carter. But I just wanted to cover the

733
00:43:18.000 --> 00:43:21.119
murder of Ramin Casiano by Harlan Carter. But yeah, I

734
00:43:21.159 --> 00:43:24.159
was like, damn, that's a nice song, like it's just

735
00:43:24.199 --> 00:43:28.039
some good white people. Yeah yeah, coming to the defense

736
00:43:28.079 --> 00:43:31.840
of Ramon, Like I didn't know the song consisted, but

737
00:43:31.880 --> 00:43:34.360
like now a bunch of people know who Ramon Gian

738
00:43:34.599 --> 00:43:37.000
was because listen to this band already, so I was like,

739
00:43:37.039 --> 00:43:41.239
that's beautiful. So yeah, that that was the case. What

740
00:43:41.360 --> 00:43:45.239
an Infury reading story, very very but I wanted to

741
00:43:45.239 --> 00:43:48.159
make it all related to uh the Carbon and Christina

742
00:43:48.199 --> 00:43:51.559
podcast universe. So he saw as a known operation. Went back,

743
00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:53.920
Hardy Carter. We need to show a name for them.

744
00:43:53.960 --> 00:43:55.840
But yeah, yeah we did. We don't need to think

745
00:43:55.840 --> 00:43:58.119
of it right now. But no, no, we won't. We

746
00:43:58.119 --> 00:44:00.519
don't know right now. But yeah, I guess it's like

747
00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:02.239
a little break here. Then we'll come back with spooky

748
00:44:02.280 --> 00:44:13.480
recommendations and we're back. So should I start with mine?

749
00:44:13.519 --> 00:44:16.159
Or did you find yours? Well? I found it, but

750
00:44:16.199 --> 00:44:17.920
I don't remember. Did I already talk about how to

751
00:44:17.960 --> 00:44:20.000
sell one hundred house? Or no? No, you have it?

752
00:44:20.119 --> 00:44:23.320
Oh okay, anyway, five out of five. I just this

753
00:44:23.400 --> 00:44:27.079
is my I think it's only the second Grady Hendrick.

754
00:44:27.239 --> 00:44:31.079
That's his name, Hendrix, right, Grady Hendrix. Yeah. I think

755
00:44:31.079 --> 00:44:35.039
it's only the second book. I listened to the audiobook

756
00:44:35.039 --> 00:44:37.239
and I think it's the only second one, Only the

757
00:44:37.280 --> 00:44:40.239
second one I've listened of his. I can't talk it more.

758
00:44:41.280 --> 00:44:44.519
Their second Grady book, Yeah, yeah, yeah, and the first

759
00:44:44.519 --> 00:44:47.360
one I read. I think I mentioned it. Probably it

760
00:44:47.400 --> 00:44:51.840
was The Southern Book Club's Guide to Slain Vampire. Oh,

761
00:44:52.119 --> 00:44:54.480
I still haven't read that. I loved it. I loved it.

762
00:44:54.519 --> 00:44:56.559
A lot of people complain because they're like, the name

763
00:44:56.639 --> 00:45:01.000
is misleading because there's only one vampirement it doesn't matter.

764
00:45:01.199 --> 00:45:03.519
It doesn't matter because they need to learn how to

765
00:45:03.519 --> 00:45:07.280
slay a vampire. It doesn't matter. It was good because

766
00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:10.239
it's not Okay, the vampire. Yes, it's about the vampire,

767
00:45:10.280 --> 00:45:12.239
but it's about so much more than that. It's about

768
00:45:12.239 --> 00:45:14.599
the women, and it's about the trends you made along

769
00:45:14.599 --> 00:45:17.760
the way. Yeah, okay, And there's the thing I love

770
00:45:17.840 --> 00:45:20.840
more than like, yes, I love the paranormal, but I

771
00:45:20.880 --> 00:45:22.599
love it to be like wayzier than that. I love

772
00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:27.400
it to be about their relationships, right, yeah, the complexities

773
00:45:27.559 --> 00:45:30.559
of that. So I'm all about that. And how to

774
00:45:30.599 --> 00:45:33.559
Stell a Hunted House was very similar. And I saw

775
00:45:33.800 --> 00:45:36.239
also someone complaining about the name. Oh, they should have

776
00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:38.599
named it something about puppets, Like who fucking cares. It's

777
00:45:38.599 --> 00:45:41.920
still a hunted house, stop, but there's still involved. What's

778
00:45:41.920 --> 00:45:45.440
a word so heard? It's weird about it. There's like

779
00:45:45.440 --> 00:45:50.559
a fancy word I'm looking for, like fatitious, but I'm no,

780
00:45:50.719 --> 00:45:55.199
that's facetious. Facetious. Maybe I guess this's wrong. Still, I

781
00:45:55.239 --> 00:45:57.000
don't know. No, that's how you say. Didn't they just

782
00:45:57.039 --> 00:45:58.599
say what you said? But doesn't it sound weird? But

783
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:03.519
she kept saying it that's wrong. No, you can't say

784
00:46:03.679 --> 00:46:07.039
it wrong. Okay, whatever that word, that's how I felt.

785
00:46:09.039 --> 00:46:11.880
My masters didn't teach me how to say that word. Okay,

786
00:46:12.360 --> 00:46:16.000
like dense? Stop being so yeah? Yeah, but uh, there's

787
00:46:16.000 --> 00:46:18.159
nothing to love I more, nothing I love more about

788
00:46:18.199 --> 00:46:25.639
like reading about much kim flipping the words. Isn't there

789
00:46:25.639 --> 00:46:30.800
a disability for that verbal dysplex? Yeah? I don't know,

790
00:46:31.719 --> 00:46:37.719
because that's what I'm doing with my words right now. Okay,

791
00:46:37.719 --> 00:46:41.800
I do with numbers. There's nothing I love more than

792
00:46:43.440 --> 00:46:47.719
I just that's wrong. Yeah, thank you. Uh, family dysfunction.

793
00:46:48.840 --> 00:46:55.760
This has sibling rivalry, generational trauma. I love with the

794
00:46:55.800 --> 00:46:58.960
Haunted house and evil puppet. You know what's not to love?

795
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:02.920
I really if I had five out of five? How exciting? Okay, Yeah,

796
00:47:03.199 --> 00:47:05.320
I gotta check it out and then I guess since

797
00:47:05.320 --> 00:47:09.079
I already have it open. I also I started a

798
00:47:09.199 --> 00:47:11.239
series and listened to the first two, but I only

799
00:47:11.320 --> 00:47:13.199
have notes on the first one. So I'm just gonna

800
00:47:13.360 --> 00:47:15.840
talk about that one. But I listened to the ex

801
00:47:15.960 --> 00:47:19.840
Hex Bye. I want to say her name is Ernine Erlin. No,

802
00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:21.239
I just look at it because I'm not saying it

803
00:47:21.280 --> 00:47:24.840
right erin Aaron Starling or something like that. So this

804
00:47:24.920 --> 00:47:28.280
is like a series about witches, and the first one

805
00:47:28.440 --> 00:47:32.639
is about nine years ago. Vivian Jones nurse to broken

806
00:47:32.679 --> 00:47:36.480
Heart like any young witch would, vodka, weepy music, bubble bats,

807
00:47:36.519 --> 00:47:39.480
and occurs on the Horrible Boyfriend. Sure, Vivi knows that

808
00:47:39.599 --> 00:47:42.519
she knows she shouldn't use her magic this way, but

809
00:47:42.679 --> 00:47:46.519
with only an orchard hay ride scented candle on hand,

810
00:47:47.639 --> 00:47:50.880
she isn't worried that it'll cause him anything more than

811
00:47:50.920 --> 00:47:53.960
a bad hair day or two. That is until Reese Penhallo,

812
00:47:54.159 --> 00:47:57.760
descendant of the towns and ancestors, breaker of hearts and

813
00:47:57.800 --> 00:48:02.199
annoyingly justice gorgeous as he always as, returns to Graves Glen, Georgia.

814
00:48:02.639 --> 00:48:04.960
What should be a quick trip to recharge the town's

815
00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:08.800
and lay lines and making appearance at the annual Fall Festival,

816
00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:13.519
turns disasterbly wrong, with one calamity after another, Striking Rees,

817
00:48:13.920 --> 00:48:16.639
viv realizes her silly little x Hex may not have

818
00:48:16.719 --> 00:48:20.039
been so harmless after all. Suddenly Graves Glenn is under

819
00:48:20.079 --> 00:48:23.159
attack from murderous wind up toys, a piste off ghost,

820
00:48:23.599 --> 00:48:26.119
and a talking cat with some interesting things to say.

821
00:48:26.800 --> 00:48:29.760
Wavy and Reese have to ignore their off the charts

822
00:48:29.840 --> 00:48:32.800
chemistry to work together to save the town and find

823
00:48:32.840 --> 00:48:34.920
a way to break up curse before it's too late. So,

824
00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:37.239
which is a fine little listen. The next one is

825
00:48:37.280 --> 00:48:40.079
also a fine little listen, And have the third one

826
00:48:40.079 --> 00:48:45.440
on hold at the library. That sounds fun? Yeah, it

827
00:48:45.519 --> 00:48:47.760
was fun, and who doesn't. It reminds me of like

828
00:48:47.800 --> 00:48:50.480
the Brain of the teenage, which but like funnier like yeah,

829
00:48:50.559 --> 00:48:56.199
start like more more romcom. Yeah, yeah, that sounds fun. Yeah,

830
00:48:55.639 --> 00:49:03.599
I'll have to check it out if I remember. I

831
00:49:03.639 --> 00:49:06.599
completely forgot. Carmen actually reminded me that I read. I

832
00:49:06.639 --> 00:49:09.599
actually read a book, Like I didn't listen to it

833
00:49:09.639 --> 00:49:12.320
and you never shared about it. Yeah, and I forgot

834
00:49:12.360 --> 00:49:14.360
to talk. I need to remember to write that down

835
00:49:14.519 --> 00:49:19.199
for my next one. Actually, but go on, okay, okay,

836
00:49:19.280 --> 00:49:23.599
So I read The Devil in Silver by Vixer Laval

837
00:49:24.480 --> 00:49:29.760
and I have to say fun, creepy. I love his books. Well,

838
00:49:29.800 --> 00:49:32.239
I've only read one, but this is the only one

839
00:49:32.280 --> 00:49:36.679
I've read. The Ballad of Something Tom has been on

840
00:49:36.719 --> 00:49:40.280
my list for forever when we get the synopsis. So

841
00:49:40.360 --> 00:49:45.719
here's a synopsis. Pepper is a rambunctious big man, minor league,

842
00:49:45.760 --> 00:49:48.760
trouble maker, working class hero in his own mind and

843
00:49:48.840 --> 00:49:52.239
suddenly the surprise inmates of a budget strapped the mental

844
00:49:52.280 --> 00:49:55.920
institution in Queens, New York. He's not mentally ill, but

845
00:49:55.960 --> 00:49:58.400
that doesn't seem to matter. He's accused of a crime

846
00:49:58.480 --> 00:50:01.920
he can't quite square with his memory and the darkness

847
00:50:01.920 --> 00:50:05.679
of his room. On his first night, he's visited by

848
00:50:05.679 --> 00:50:08.239
a terrifying creature with the body of an old man

849
00:50:08.280 --> 00:50:11.280
and the head of a bison. Oh my God, nearly

850
00:50:11.440 --> 00:50:14.960
kills him before being hustled away by the hospital staff.

851
00:50:15.039 --> 00:50:18.880
Wow snow delusion. The other patients confirm that a hungry

852
00:50:18.960 --> 00:50:22.599
devil roams the hallways. When the sun goes down, Pepper

853
00:50:22.719 --> 00:50:26.039
rallies three other inmates in a plot to fight back. Dorry,

854
00:50:26.719 --> 00:50:31.239
an octagenarian schizophrenic who's been on the ward for decades

855
00:50:31.320 --> 00:50:36.239
and knows all of its secrets. Coffee in African immigrant

856
00:50:36.280 --> 00:50:39.719
with severe OCD who tries desperately to send alarms to

857
00:50:39.760 --> 00:50:45.280
the outside world. And Lucci, a bipolar teen girl who

858
00:50:45.320 --> 00:50:50.880
acts as the group's enforcer. She's badass, battling the pill

859
00:50:50.960 --> 00:50:54.599
pushing staff one another and their own minds. They tried

860
00:50:54.639 --> 00:50:58.039
to kill the monster that's stuck in them, but can

861
00:50:58.199 --> 00:51:02.440
the devil die? And yeah, it was so good. There

862
00:51:02.480 --> 00:51:04.639
is one part that kind of seems a little unnecessary

863
00:51:04.719 --> 00:51:06.360
to me that I'm like, why is the supid in here?

864
00:51:06.440 --> 00:51:07.840
I don't care about this, But it was like the

865
00:51:07.960 --> 00:51:09.800
romance part of the book, So that kind of tells

866
00:51:09.840 --> 00:51:13.320
more about me. I love a little romance. I was

867
00:51:13.400 --> 00:51:16.320
just I wanted more of the devil. I just wanted

868
00:51:16.320 --> 00:51:20.920
to string No, just in this instance. That's so funny

869
00:51:21.000 --> 00:51:25.039
because like in other books, like Vampires, the romance was

870
00:51:25.079 --> 00:51:26.800
like but it was like I guess, it was like

871
00:51:26.840 --> 00:51:29.519
a major thing, not like just a little. Yeah, it

872
00:51:29.559 --> 00:51:33.320
was throughout the whole book. From the beginning. Here Pepper

873
00:51:34.119 --> 00:51:37.480
goes in here, he meets these people, they rally a plan,

874
00:51:37.639 --> 00:51:40.559
it goes wrong, then they stop, they stop all talking

875
00:51:40.599 --> 00:51:42.480
to each other and he meets someone else. And then

876
00:51:42.719 --> 00:51:44.519
in that in the middle of that, when their plan

877
00:51:44.599 --> 00:51:47.880
goes wrong, he meets someone else and then it's only

878
00:51:48.039 --> 00:51:51.360
like a book time or not, like for Pepper, it's

879
00:51:51.360 --> 00:51:53.960
not a long time, but they fall in love. They

880
00:51:54.039 --> 00:51:56.679
and it's cute. But I'm like, I skip this. I

881
00:51:56.719 --> 00:51:58.760
want to see what happens to the devil, like to

882
00:51:58.800 --> 00:52:02.599
the devil when they come front him again, and really

883
00:52:02.639 --> 00:52:07.079
it's like, yeah, the Devil's creepy and like why is

884
00:52:07.119 --> 00:52:09.840
he there? What's going on? But also just the horrors

885
00:52:09.880 --> 00:52:15.320
of the mental institution itself and what they do to

886
00:52:15.559 --> 00:52:19.440
the patients there. Uh, that's also so creepy, and just

887
00:52:19.480 --> 00:52:22.840
the state that it's in. It's just who doesn't love

888
00:52:23.159 --> 00:52:26.719
an asylum, like a hunted asylum? You know. That's specifically

889
00:52:26.719 --> 00:52:28.320
why I found the book because I was looking for

890
00:52:28.400 --> 00:52:30.719
like something that took place in an asylum, and I

891
00:52:30.840 --> 00:52:36.280
found out that this book is being adapted into TV.

892
00:52:36.440 --> 00:52:39.159
It's gonna be season three of The Terror. And I

893
00:52:39.280 --> 00:52:41.360
actually don't know if I talked about The Terror before.

894
00:52:41.480 --> 00:52:45.320
I don't think so. Season one of The Terror amazing.

895
00:52:45.480 --> 00:52:50.800
It's set in the winter, like it seems like colonial times.

896
00:52:51.480 --> 00:52:53.280
The French are like trying to get somewhere and they

897
00:52:53.320 --> 00:52:56.480
can come up like to this like very snowy area

898
00:52:57.119 --> 00:53:00.960
and then there's zombies. Oh, and it's just like a

899
00:53:01.000 --> 00:53:06.280
good winter. I think, watch wait what is it on Hulu?

900
00:53:07.039 --> 00:53:09.719
And also I am seeing it but haven't watched it,

901
00:53:09.800 --> 00:53:11.679
you know what I mean? M hm, Yeah, it's like

902
00:53:11.719 --> 00:53:14.920
it starts a little slow, but like it's necessary. It's

903
00:53:15.000 --> 00:53:17.159
like it adds to like I think I started watching

904
00:53:17.159 --> 00:53:19.599
it and then I never finished, are you? Yeah? I

905
00:53:19.599 --> 00:53:22.800
don't think you do well with slow things sometimes sometimes

906
00:53:22.840 --> 00:53:27.960
not ually not Yeah, but man, it's like a good

907
00:53:28.079 --> 00:53:30.800
like atmospheric like because you know, it's like it's the snow,

908
00:53:31.039 --> 00:53:33.920
and like just if someone is hurt and starts bleeding

909
00:53:33.920 --> 00:53:36.199
out in the snow is just so evident it's white

910
00:53:36.239 --> 00:53:39.679
and then suddenly pull a red you know. So The

911
00:53:39.800 --> 00:53:42.920
Terror is super good. Season two is not as good

912
00:53:43.000 --> 00:53:45.400
at all. I don't even remember what it's about. But

913
00:53:45.679 --> 00:53:48.519
The Terror is based on a book. It's also and

914
00:53:48.559 --> 00:53:51.159
so Seizing one of it, and so season three is

915
00:53:51.199 --> 00:53:55.320
also going to be based on this book. And oh god,

916
00:53:55.360 --> 00:53:57.840
what is his name? Dan Stevens, who I've talked about

917
00:53:57.880 --> 00:54:00.239
before and how much I love him. Okay, so not

918
00:54:00.400 --> 00:54:04.320
looking at what Oh my god, we've already I've already

919
00:54:04.320 --> 00:54:06.440
shown you pictures off. I know went that's what I'm saying.

920
00:54:06.920 --> 00:54:09.239
You don't think I don't remember. I don't know what

921
00:54:09.239 --> 00:54:16.159
it looks like. I'm just assuming you're okay. Anyway, he

922
00:54:16.599 --> 00:54:20.079
is going to star, so I'm guessing he's Pepper. Oh,

923
00:54:20.679 --> 00:54:22.920
he's gonna be Pepper. I think if that just makes

924
00:54:22.920 --> 00:54:25.559
it think of New Girl, Detective Pepper or whatever, Pepper.

925
00:54:25.760 --> 00:54:29.360
It's not Pepper that sounded so, Yeah, you're right. I

926
00:54:29.360 --> 00:54:32.440
thought of that too. I don't remember his name, his

927
00:54:32.480 --> 00:54:35.639
full name Jack Pepper. I don't know. I think so

928
00:54:35.880 --> 00:54:40.079
John Pepper. I think it's Jack Jack anyway, So I'm

929
00:54:40.119 --> 00:54:41.880
very excited for that. I don't know when it's coming out,

930
00:54:41.920 --> 00:54:44.639
but it's gonna be good. Dan Stevens. Even if you

931
00:54:44.719 --> 00:54:47.239
don't care that, if you don't think he's not, if

932
00:54:47.239 --> 00:54:49.360
you don't find him attractive like I do, I'm he's

933
00:54:49.360 --> 00:54:52.280
still an amazing actor, like he brings it to any role.

934
00:54:53.000 --> 00:54:55.960
There's already there's another show called Legion that he's in,

935
00:54:56.119 --> 00:54:59.119
and for part of the show they're in an asylum. Also,

936
00:54:59.159 --> 00:55:04.719
I'll be Aubrey plause Us in Legion. Yeah, that's also. Uh,

937
00:55:04.800 --> 00:55:06.880
I've only seen the first season, but it was really good.

938
00:55:08.079 --> 00:55:10.719
But yeah, I'm excited for this because yeah, the book

939
00:55:10.800 --> 00:55:12.840
was amazing and I'm sure I feel like the show

940
00:55:12.920 --> 00:55:14.920
is probably gonna be good too. So yeah, those are

941
00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:18.039
my speaking recommendations. We can be done. I'm just looking

942
00:55:18.079 --> 00:55:20.559
them up. Oh you're looking at him up? Okay, Well

943
00:55:20.599 --> 00:55:23.679
I don't remember him and when I talked about uh

944
00:55:25.039 --> 00:55:29.519
Abigail the movie, Oh, because he's an Abigail. No, he's

945
00:55:29.559 --> 00:55:31.920
not bad looking. His eyes are just very creepy, but

946
00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:37.639
that's expected. Yeah, yeah, it adds to the whole, like

947
00:55:37.679 --> 00:55:40.519
when he's a bad guy in Oh I can imagine, yes,

948
00:55:40.679 --> 00:55:44.519
and very like Abigail. Which. Actually, we're going to talk

949
00:55:44.559 --> 00:55:47.800
about our favorite vampire media at some point for Patreon.

950
00:55:48.079 --> 00:55:54.199
That's right. I needn't tell that it was fun anyway. Okay,

951
00:55:54.280 --> 00:55:59.239
so just to reminder that if you join Patreon, you

952
00:55:59.280 --> 00:56:01.239
can hear us talk about a lot of things. Our

953
00:56:01.280 --> 00:56:03.519
favorite zombie media is. When we just did that was

954
00:56:03.559 --> 00:56:06.480
almost two hour song form. We read fun. It was

955
00:56:06.519 --> 00:56:09.440
so fun. I had such a great time. Nor really,

956
00:56:09.480 --> 00:56:11.119
we just read Reddit stories to each other that are

957
00:56:11.159 --> 00:56:13.400
creepy and react to them, which is kind of fun.

958
00:56:13.440 --> 00:56:16.920
You also have paranormal News. Paranormal News is another thing

959
00:56:16.920 --> 00:56:19.719
we do on there, and if you're you know, interested

960
00:56:19.719 --> 00:56:24.039
in that or the eight dollars tier gets awesome keychain.

961
00:56:24.159 --> 00:56:28.519
So that's another thing. But you know, check out the Patreon.

962
00:56:28.599 --> 00:56:32.079
You can also give Patreon memberships to people now, so

963
00:56:32.199 --> 00:56:37.480
that's holiday And then just a reminder, I completely forgot,

964
00:56:37.599 --> 00:56:40.239
but on November first, Apple started doing this weird thing

965
00:56:40.280 --> 00:56:43.000
where they charged way more for people that are signing

966
00:56:43.039 --> 00:56:47.679
up for Patreon subscriptions on the app. So it's better

967
00:56:47.719 --> 00:56:49.519
if you're going to you know, subscribe, not even just

968
00:56:49.599 --> 00:56:51.159
to us, but if you're like I want to support

969
00:56:51.159 --> 00:56:55.000
this creator, get on your computer or a web browser

970
00:56:55.079 --> 00:56:57.480
to do it. Don't do it through the Patreon app

971
00:56:57.880 --> 00:57:02.360
on your iPhone. More. Yeah, they made this like dirty

972
00:57:02.360 --> 00:57:05.920
percent charge or something like that. Yeah, and then like

973
00:57:06.039 --> 00:57:08.360
either we take the cut or you take the cut.

974
00:57:08.480 --> 00:57:12.079
Like someone's going to take the cut, not Patreon. So yeah,

975
00:57:12.119 --> 00:57:16.599
so yeah, just sign up on the website and yeah, okay,

976
00:57:16.679 --> 00:57:19.679
I think that's all the announcements we have. Oh sorry,

977
00:57:19.719 --> 00:57:22.400
Our current book, cup Breed is The Witches of Basle.

978
00:57:22.519 --> 00:57:27.000
Did you get your book? Yes, just start in the box. Okay,

979
00:57:27.239 --> 00:57:29.239
I have it already either I just got it. Oka,

980
00:57:29.440 --> 00:57:31.519
well I got it like earlier in the week, but

981
00:57:32.239 --> 00:57:39.639
okay last week. Yeah, okay, I know I can't now stop.

982
00:57:41.239 --> 00:57:45.559
All right, that's it now. Yeah, and I don't know,

983
00:57:47.199 --> 00:57:52.840
watch out for shadow. Oh yeah, that's who I was

984
00:57:52.880 --> 00:57:54.599
just gonna say, watch out for shadows in the middle

985
00:57:54.599 --> 00:57:58.280
of the night when you're visiting your family. Yeah, but

986
00:57:58.400 --> 00:58:02.800
also that and say spooky. We'll catch everyone next time.

987
00:58:02.880 --> 00:58:06.000
By my Let's give a quick shout out to our

988
00:58:06.039 --> 00:58:09.159
newest patron member, Fred, who just became a member of

989
00:58:09.199 --> 00:58:12.000
the No Mammes super series. Spookie, I still have to

990
00:58:12.000 --> 00:58:14.000
send your key chain out, but I will, I promise.

991
00:58:14.119 --> 00:58:15.960
And a shout out to the rest of our members,

992
00:58:15.960 --> 00:58:20.760
am Marien Drossadio, Avery Lissandro Robin Oryan, Wesley and Leslie,

993
00:58:20.880 --> 00:58:26.079
Leslie and Wesley, Jessica escavel alec Ilsi, pered Gul, Carina

994
00:58:26.719 --> 00:58:35.079
Mannied Mal Hilary Archer, Marlene, Patricia, Marilyn Lupe, Jorge, Anastasia, Linda, Juan, Clarissa,

995
00:58:35.280 --> 00:58:40.719
Becky la A, Joel Helfire, Herzon, Alejandro Laney, Something rather

996
00:58:40.760 --> 00:58:44.679
than Not in podcasts, Chatta Christina, A Nightmare on Fear, Street,

997
00:58:44.800 --> 00:58:50.440
Mari Desire, Sonja, Leanna Nacho, Mama, Nellie, Alex Naziel, Mariveele

998
00:58:50.519 --> 00:58:57.039
and Malia Ashes and Janie Michelle Modesto, Perlaena Bellone, our

999
00:58:57.079 --> 00:59:00.800
cousin Martin, it Is Ghostrain and Mark on Charity. Thank

1000
00:59:00.840 --> 00:59:03.679
you so much for supporting the podcast, to support me

1001
00:59:03.679 --> 00:59:06.159
in the world. To us as book Tells is hosted

1002
00:59:06.159 --> 00:59:09.639
by Christina and Carmen, produced and edited by Christina, researched

1003
00:59:09.639 --> 00:59:12.679
by Christina Carmen and with the help of Don shout

1004
00:59:12.719 --> 00:59:15.199
out with Don. If you aren't joying the podcast considerably,

1005
00:59:15.199 --> 00:59:17.559
going to say five star review, we would really appreciate it.

1006
00:59:17.599 --> 00:59:19.280
If you don't want to the five star review, just

1007
00:59:19.320 --> 00:59:21.840
don't leave a review. But don't even even lower than that, please,

1008
00:59:22.000 --> 00:59:24.199
I'm just kidding. You can reach out to the podcast

1009
00:59:24.400 --> 00:59:26.480
at at Spoakatos at gmail dot com. You can go

1010
00:59:26.480 --> 00:59:29.239
to our website at bookitos dot com and fill out

1011
00:59:29.239 --> 00:59:31.719
the contact form. If you want to support the podcast,

1012
00:59:31.800 --> 00:59:35.239
you can join our Patreon where we send exclusive stickers,

1013
00:59:35.360 --> 00:59:39.079
have bonus episodes. Eight dollar members get an exclusive key chain.

1014
00:59:39.199 --> 00:59:41.480
It's super cool. I got new ones and these ones

1015
00:59:41.480 --> 00:59:44.199
are huge and if you want to support but you

1016
00:59:44.239 --> 00:59:46.559
can or don't want to join the Patreon, that's fine too.

1017
00:59:46.679 --> 00:59:50.480
You can also get some merch You can find sure Sessay,

1018
00:59:50.599 --> 00:59:53.679
Spooky and old English letters. There's a beanie. I love

1019
00:59:53.719 --> 00:59:57.719
the beanie. There's also a hat. There's a no mamss

1020
00:59:57.719 --> 01:00:01.360
shirt which is a fan favorite. There's a lot of options,

1021
01:00:01.400 --> 01:00:04.519
crap tops, sweaters. It's almost swetter weather. We're nearing a

1022
01:00:04.559 --> 01:00:07.840
Spookie season, so yeah, get your hoodies. You're gonna need them.

1023
01:00:07.880 --> 01:00:09.719
If you don't want to do all that, that's fine too.

1024
01:00:09.920 --> 01:00:12.440
You can just listen like you're listening now, and that's

1025
01:00:12.480 --> 01:00:14.000
the best support that you can give us. Like I

1026
01:00:14.079 --> 01:00:16.760
always say in our ad break and yeah, I feel

1027
01:00:16.840 --> 01:00:21.679
like history. You can follow Estodia's Unknown Mining, Carmen's other podcasts,

1028
01:00:22.039 --> 01:00:24.159
and you can find a Spooky taels on all of

1029
01:00:24.199 --> 01:00:27.239
our socials at a Spooky Tells All. This is in

1030
01:00:27.320 --> 01:00:31.000
the show notes and we appreciate every single listen. Thank

1031
01:00:31.039 --> 01:00:32.760
you so much. Stay as Spooky